4.1 qts vs 5.8 qts ?

[EMS]

The '79 and '80 manual also mentions appx. 4.0 quarts after a change. What I haven't seen yet (still reading) is whether or not this is for a simple drain and fill or also includes a filter change. Does anybody know if the oil cooler drains when ONLY the engine drain plug is removed?? Also, this may have been touched on before, but the bike is definitely supposed to be on the centerstand according to the manual (and the dipstick is not to be screwed in. as mentioned above).

All I know for sure is that my '79 takes well over 5 quarts with an oil and filter change.

Ron: The manual doesn't mention approx. 4.0 quarts. It mentions 4 liters and the equivalent of 4.2qts in paranthesis ( 1 quart = 0.95 liter, 4 liters = 4.2 quarts) . This is for an oil AND filter change. Clearly stated. The oil cooler connections are on top of the cooler body. It will not drain, as long as the bike is on the center stand. Also, the oil cavities for the cams behind the pool plates in the head will not drain, as everybody who ever adjusted valves on a CBX will confirm. Putting the bike on the sidestand and leaning over to the right for a while will help drain a little more. Still, quite some oil will remain.
If Honda would have increased the oil capacity "on some bikes" ( another American conspiracy theory ) and the bike would use significantly more than 4 liters for an oil change, somewhere should be a specification about how much oil to use after an engine overhaul/assembly. Using the relation of the specification that we 'others" seem to have, i.e. 4.2 vs 5.8 qts, an assembly should require at least 7 qts, if not more. I have looked everywhere, and I can not find a specification like that.
Tim's is selling a deep oil pan (that was originally designed by Mike Dondellinger, I believe) They say that this part increases the oil capacity by one quart. You need to look at this. It is approximately 1 inch deep and looks like it holds a substantial volume. If this pan on my CBX increases the capacity during fluid filter change to only 5.2 quarts (from 4.2 quarts), I have absolutely no idea what a bike would look like that holds 5.5 quarts or more.

[oilheadron]

Lots of comments: My reference to appx. 4.0 quarts was generic and admittedly should have been "roughly 4 quarts" or something like that. I was going from memory! :) Maybe I need to dust off my Mechanical/Aerospace Engineering Degree (but dusty or not, I still don't need an explanation of the difference between quarts and liters!!). :) But, I don't want to, that's no fun, and this is not work (CBXs are playtoys, not the XB-37!!!). My bike may very well have an extra capacity oil pan; I don't know yet but will check. Also, it doesn't have a centerstand and is always level on a lift during an oil change but is still on the tires. Another drainage variable.

Over the years I've seen quite a few "oil/filter change vs. overhaul/assembly" oil quantity specs but I don't remember one being as high as 1 1/2+ quarts. But, my memory isn't what it is used to be (and maybe never was). :) Of course, the CBX is a unique beast. This isn't a SOHC 750 Four by any means.

[Don]

Obviously . . . . since the capacities are the same across the board, no matter which year, the amount required to fill it to the full mark on the dipstick (forget about measuring it any other way) is directly related to how much of the old oil you drain out - If you get a more complete drain then you'll have to put more back in

Mine takes more than 4 quarts, almost 5 . . . . wish it took the full 5.8 but you're never going to get all of the oil off the top of the head, no matter what you do - Only changing 75% of your oil isn't something you revel in . . . . it means your new oil is 25% contaminated before you start the engine. Leave the bike on the sidestand overnight and then put it on the centerstand to change it and maybe you can get that number up closer to 5 . . . . certainly a better idea than changing it hot, on the centerstand, immediately after you shut it off - I'd much rather get out MORE oil than less HOT oil . . . .

Loosening one connection on the oil cooler (to let in some air) will probably allow you to drain the cooler and both of the hoses as well - easier to do that when the engine is cold as well. If you're hung up on draining hot oil, leave it on the sidestand for at least an hour or so prior to the drain and see how much it takes to fill

Don

[Mike Cecchini]

Both of you guys are right no doubt....... and exactly why it really suprised me whent it took over 5.5 qts to reach the "max' line on my dipstick. Will know more in couple days.......will take pics for the naysayer.

Thanks.

[EMS]

I was told I don't read the posts. Here is what started the whole thing and what I responded to.

I got out the factory service manual and lo and behold..... "5.5 liters" (5.8 US qts) was listed. Then, just for grins I went on-line and found a Cycle World article on the 80X http://www.cbxclub.com/davespage/cbx80-4.html , http://www.cbxclub.com/davespage/cbx80-6.html ....with it's comments about the 20% increase in oil for the 80 vs 79..... clearly implying that Honda saw a need to increase the oil capacity for some reason.

1. Any thoughts on why the 79 4.1 qts might not be adequate ?

2. Did the increase 5.8 U.S. qts follow on to the 81 & 82 X's ?

Thanks.

This is what we were discussing. And this is what needed to be said to this

1. The 5.5 liters in the manual are not for an oil and filter change but for an engine assembly
2. There was no 20% increase in oil for the 1980 - nothing clearly implied that Honda saw a need to increase the oil capacity
(other than giving the bike a larger oil cooler)
3. 4 Liters are 4.2 quarts, not 4.1 quarts and there is no indication they are not adequate
4. Finally, again, there was no increase to 5.8 qts and the 81/82 also had the same oil capacity as the 79/80

These were the issues. What you guys pour into your bikes, is your business.

[Jeff Bennetts]

[quote="EMS]Tim's is selling a deep oil pan (that was originally designed by Mike Dondellinger, I believe) They say that this part increases the oil capacity by one quart. You need to look at this. It is approximately 1 inch deep and looks like it holds a substantial volume. If this pan on my CBX increases the capacity during fluid filter change to only 5.2 quarts (from 4.2 quarts), I have absolutely no idea what a bike would look like that holds 5.5 quarts or more. [/quote]

Actually Mike, Pat Mattachione fabricated the first deep oil pan for his CBX he campaigned in WERA, Mike D. saw it on Pat's bike during a show and tell at an ICOA National at Marlinton in the 90's when all the California guys came down, thats the same year Pat displayed his Indy style head for the CBX, theres a better pic somewhere in the ICOA picture gallery.

Thats also the year the new California ICOA Dir. picked up a freshly rebuilt Spondon CBX on the way to the rally, took it out for its maiden voyage and blew it up ten miles down the road because the builder put the cams in backward.

[EMS]

Actually Mike, Pat Mattachione fabricated the first deep oil pan for his CBX he campaigned in WERA, Mike D. saw it on Pat's bike during a show and tell at an ICOA National at Marlinton in the 90's when all the California guys came down, thats the same year Pat displayed his Indy style head for the CBX, theres a better pic somewhere in the ICOA picture gallery.

Thats also the year the new California ICOA Dir. picked up a freshly rebuilt Spondon CBX on the way to the rally, took it out for its maiden voyage and blew it up ten miles down the road because the builder put the cams in backward.

Some really interesting things there, Jeff! I am sure most of us would like to hear/see more about the "indy style head for the CBX"
I think that California Spondon CBX has changed hands in the meantime I may be wrong about that, though.

[Jeff Bennetts]

I have some pictures somewhere, I'll have to see what machine they are on and I'll post them up. They ended up on Fleebay a couple years ago, along with the matching smoothbore flatslide Mikunis and the composite rims. John Janosik bought the custom Kerker exhaust and some other engine stuff.

That Spondon was a thing of beauty, glad someone ended up with it, is it road worthy now?