'80 ignition timing

bobber · Post by **bobber** » Sun Jul 06, 2008 7:48 pm

In Toronto now for some Fall Protection training but this morning, to kill some time before leaving, took #1 and 6 plugs out. Both nice tan color. Wondering if the full can of Sea-Foam I have in the gas may have something to do with pinging?

alimey4u2 · Post by **alimey4u2** » Mon Jul 07, 2008 4:21 am

bobber wrote:In Toronto now for some Fall Protection training but this morning, to kill some time before leaving, took #1 and 6 plugs out. Both nice tan color. Wondering if the full can of Sea-Foam I have in the gas may have something to do with pinging?

I found that to be the case when I used a heavy ( over winter) dose of "Yamaha" gas stabiliser...

bobber · Post by **bobber** » Sat Aug 09, 2008 9:21 am

I've had bike out couple times with pulsar set up as per manual. Bike starts great, quiet and much more power...just about a match for the FJR. However when warms up it's tight to start and noisy. Plugs are white. Not good. Compression in 140 range... so good.
Bike has the upgraded advancer, K&N air filter and set of Supertrapps with 7 disc's. Now thinking jetting is issue, not timing. Jetting stock at 110 so thinking of jetting up to 120's. But have no idea how Keihen jets range. Mikuni's I'm familar with.
On side note a buddy dropped off a 2001 EX250 for me to look at. Doesn't start but has spark and fuel. Its compression at 110/side. Worked on a 900 Ninja few years back with a similar issue. Turned out tight valves. Adjusted and running since. While first looking at bike discovered it wouldn't shift into second, he didn't know that as just picked up bike for his daughter. Down to first and back to neutral no problem but not up to second. Cann't spin rear tire when bike in first and spark plugs out whether clutch in or out.
Now which bike to pick at first.

dan1995 · Post by **dan1995** » Sat Aug 09, 2008 9:41 am

I have a 500 ninja it won't shift into second either unless it's running.....must be a safety feature

alimey4u2 · Post by **alimey4u2** » Sat Aug 09, 2008 10:00 am

bobber wrote: But have no idea how Keihen jets range. Mikuni's I'm familar with.

I have always believed that they are the same, the numbers indicating the flow capacity in milliliters per minute. Some aftermarket jets use drill size which means nothing without a flow formulae...

Wait for Mike Nixon to confirm though.....

bobber · Post by **bobber** » Mon Aug 11, 2008 8:09 am

Adjusted valves on the 250 to spec... made no difference. Took top end off. Come to find crank bearings must of spun... each rod has about 1/4" up/down movement. So yanked engine out and had owner look at it, suggesting he look for another engine. As for shifting, appears thats the way those 250's designed. Must be a pain if dead battery.
Pulled carbs on the CBX in the afternoon. Carbs very grungy inside. 2 slow jets blocked and for mains I had 105's in there, not the spec'ed 110's. For some reason I installed the '82's mains at some point in time.
Cleaned up carbs, installing the 110's, and am going to shim needles. Read in a previous post by Rick Pope recommendation to shim .020". Using some small round wire terminal ends, file, side-cutters and patience to make them.

EMS · Post by **EMS** » Mon Aug 11, 2008 10:14 am

bobber wrote: Using some small round wire terminal ends, file, side-cutters and patience to make them.

Radio Shack has small washers for electric connections.

bobber · Post by **bobber** » Wed Sep 10, 2008 6:46 pm

A buddy of mine has a Snap-On timing light which has an 'advancer degree' built in, so borrowed it.
Lined up F mark and marked advancer to ignitor with soapstone.
At idle marks line up. Set timing light to 23 degrees, rev to about 2400 and marks line up again. At about 4000 marks change but it takes about 50 degrees to re-align, manual tells me at about 5500 should go to 31 degrees. Machine has the 422 advancer in it.
Called dealer looking for another advancer... discontinued... go figure.

alimey4u2 · Post by **alimey4u2** » Thu Sep 11, 2008 4:06 am

Bobber, don't forget that cincycycles make an electronic unit that dispenses with the mechanical advancer ( & pulser) although expensive...

bobber · Post by **bobber** » Sun Sep 14, 2008 4:58 pm

Installed a Daytona engine oil temp guage on the bike. Ambient temp about 15 Celcius and oil temp would run about 80 degrees on the highway(5500rpm doing 120km/hr). In town about 90 and when idling around 100.
Rechecked the timing couple of times with help from a friend who throttled bike up slowly, watching tach while I used timing light. At idle marks line up. 1600 rpm advances to 23-24 degrees and 3000 rpm advances to a little over 50 degrees.
Going to have to try and find a 469A advancer. Really don't want to burn out some valves.

cbxtacy · Post by **cbxtacy** » Sun Sep 14, 2008 11:14 pm

Bobber, pm me your address and I'll mail you one. I am known as The World's Largest Hoarder of CBX 469A Ignition Advancer's (260lbs).

bobber · Post by **bobber** » Mon Sep 15, 2008 7:55 am

PM sent... and thanks!

bobber · Post by **bobber** » Sun Oct 12, 2008 9:37 am

First of all thanks for the 469A advancer George!! Received it a few weeks back but been fairly busy at work so no time to install nor send a money order, even though you didn't want anything. Did both yesterday.
However bike is still advancing the same. I must be reading wrong instructions or timing light is screwed up.. ... cann't see two advancers doing exact same thing? Last couple of nites have been in the minus temps so the CBX and FJR both put away now and replaced with snowmobiles. Next year I'll have to check spark plugs for color. I'll be changing oil to Motul 5W50 as well. When did have bike out it pulled strong with no "knocking or pinging". If all else fails, don't like plug color, I'll manually retard the advancer.
1-Line up crank marks(F to front crank split)
2-Advancer lined up to #1/6 ignitor
3-I used soapstone on advancer washer and ignitor to give me a base line.
4-At idle marks line up but then, once throttle up, advances way out of spec at much lower rpm's speced.

The only thing I can think off would be the advancer drive shaft itself... is it possible that its somehow damaged and the increased centrifigal force when throttling up is twisting it? No.. it should be retarding... not advancing. Just thinking out loud here.

alimey4u2 · Post by **alimey4u2** » Sun Oct 12, 2008 1:00 pm

Bob, I have the Honda CBX timing wheel if you need to borrow it....
OK, You have the two stages, 23.5 deg between 2200 & 2600 & then maximum advance of 32 deg @ 6400 rpm plus according to the 1979 manual..Which would be the 469A advancer....The 1980 revisions (which I would "assume" to be the 422 advancer) says 23.5 between 2300-2500 & 31 deg @ 5600 plus....

alimey4u2 · Post by **alimey4u2** » Sun Oct 12, 2008 1:41 pm

bobber wrote: 4-At idle marks line up but then, once throttle up, advances way out of spec at much lower rpm's speced.

Midrange or highrange or both Bob ?